There’s nothing wrong you can say to someone who’s ready to get sober, and there’s nothing right that you can say to someone who isn’t ready to get sober.
Welcome to self made and sober. I’m your host Andrew a CS with self made dash coaching.com. And in this podcast, it’s my job to interview people who are not only crushing it in business, but have also struggled with addiction in the past, and our long term recovery. Be sure to join our Facebook group, where we help entrepreneurs grow and scale their [email protected] slash groups slash SMC mastermind like self made coaching mastermind. I hope you enjoy the show and be sure to subscribe and rate the show afterwards so you can get notified each Friday when we put out a new episode. Welcome to self made and server I’m here host Angela cease. And with me today is Bill Somerville bills the owner of dawn patrol digital, she’s the lead generation company that focuses on real estate and insurance professionals. And he’s not only crushing it in the marketing field, but he’s also been sober since 2014. And Bill Happy belated 35th birthday and welcome to the show.
Thanks, man. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me on. Definitely
pleasures all mine. And you’re quite the world traveler. I saw you just got back from Vegas.
Yes. One of my least favorite locations in the world actually, I I grew up right outside Atlantic City. So casinos are like not a very big boohoo attraction to me. And you’ll find out like a lot of my not so good years revolve around the Atlantic City area. So for me like going to Vegas. It’s just like, you know, I go there for business. And then I’m out on a red eye soon as I can leave.
I was there just just the other day and I guess a couple months ago, but I didn’t have the same experience. When I went the first time maybe like eight years ago, I went with my dad and and I was in I was blacked out in a poker tournament. I forgot that I played in and one in paid for the whole trip. Yeah.
Nice. So let’s get into it.
I did i think i i poker afforded me like, six years of doing the not right thing. So hey, you know when you’re good, you’re good. Right?
So so let’s get into it. Could you tell us about your journey? And what led you to get sober in 2014?
Yeah, absolutely. So we’re just talking about this a couple seconds ago, like, I never know what I’m saying in the beginning. And I think that’s, I maybe should have prepared, but I know that the guy that took me through the steps like, Hey, you know, you’re talking about your sobriety and your journey, it was no reason to really prepare, you just kind of show up and let God take the wheel and go from there. So I didn’t prepare anything. And my experience, it’s just my experience, man, you know, what led me to get sober in 2014 was the fact that I was probably going to die if I didn’t, you know, I like, like to drink, like a lot. And other things, but mainly, you know, alcohol was a big part of my story. It led me to make a lot of poor decisions, you know, when I was actively drinking, and, you know, it led me to a lot of misery. When I wasn’t drinking, you know, I just didn’t think that there was a way to, to have a life that you could be sober and enjoy. And it just didn’t make sense to me like going to the mall or going grocery shopping, or just doing anything normal, not, you know, three sheets to the wind just, I was like, wow, that’s, you know, that’s worse than death. You know, until that, that becomes the truth until like, your drinking takes you or your your you know, narcotics or, or drug abuse like takes you to, to that level. And in 2014 like that’s that’s kind of where I found myself man is you know, I just got sick and tired of being sick and tired, I guess is what they say as much as I dislike the the one liner phrases of 12 step recovery. It’s, you know, there’s a lot of truth to it. And yeah, I did, I just got sick and tired of being sick and tired. So my options at that point were to be dead, or to try something different. And I decided to try something different with the promise that if it didn’t work out, well, for me, I would just pretty much be dead. So I didn’t really have much to lose. And I think a lot of people that come in 12 step programs, like that’s pretty much it. It’s like, Well, I didn’t really have shit to lose. I don’t know if I can curse on this or not. You guys bleep it out.
Yeah, you can do whatever the F you want.
Awesome. I’m gonna take my shirt off then. Wait, you sell Yeah. Audio, right.
was like in his in the office, where and he was like, I’m cutting off Phil, us his head with a chainsaw.
Dwight put your shirt back on.
All right, I’m gonna keep my shirt on. But for an extra $2 will send you the video footage of this.
Behind the scenes, I’ll set up a membership group where you get to watch it. Yeah, that’d be great. So, so drugs and alcohol bring you to your knees. What’s what was the last straw? What was just the, I can’t keep doing this anymore.
But since it’s since it’s getting close to Mother’s Day, you know, and we talked about our mothers before this, I think was just like, really, you know, letting my mom down. Man. I know, that sounds so corny. But if you knew this woman and you knew what she went through,
and how tough she was, and just, you know, just what a phenomenal person that she is.
I just hated letting her down man. And there were times where I would get better. And like we do like most of the real alcoholics do, we get better. You know, it’s like, we’re up, we’re like a rocket of upward mobility. And then all of a sudden, you know, we, you know, come in contact with this fallacy of we’re doing this ourselves, you know, we’re, we’re self made sober people, you know,
and we’re fixed in ourselves. And, you know,
we think that we can take a drink, like, Hey, I did all this fixing. And, you know, maybe it’s cool. If I just, if I just have another one, maybe it’ll be different this time. And then that would happen occur in my brain and like, like an idiot, I would blackout, uh, you know, all my previous experiences with, with drugs and alcohol, for the this concept of, you know, I could do it right this time. And then, you know, this allergic reaction would happen, like they talk about in 12 step fellowship, where my body would demand more drugs and alcohol, but wasn’t drinking and, you know, we’re using like, a normal person, and then I’d find myself, you know, busted it out. And, you know, like, my family would be disappointed again, man, I just, I just didn’t want to continue to put them through that. Because even though I couldn’t stop drinking, and using, I did love my family. You know, I love my mother, I love my father, I love my sister. I love my aunts, and uncles. You know, I just had a lot of love people. And my, my change point was, when I thought to myself, like, maybe I should, you know, not be in this world, and that life would be easier for my loved ones. If I wasn’t there, you know, it’s, it’s a tough spot to be in. And, you know, a lot of people will go down that road, you know, out of selflessness. But, you know, that’s, that was my changing point, man. Like, when I found myself in that state of mind. It was it was a rough state of mind, man, you know, I don’t wish that upon anybody. But that’s, that’s what it took for me to get sober. You know, it wasn’t homelessness I’d seen that wasn’t, you know, my family forced me to go to a treatment facility because my family had experience with addiction. I’m come from like, an Irish and Scottish family, man. So we’re no stranger to drinking and addiction problems. This didn’t want to hurt anybody else anymore. Man, that was probably my turn around, is when I hit that.
So 2014, you’re getting sober? Is it easy at first? Or are you struggling getting getting down? What’s the beginning look like for you?
was it easy at first, I guess my just my experience with it was, was that it was easy for me, right? Because I had waited until my life was such a massive mess. Like I got sober at 30 years old, right? I didn’t want to go into the rooms of these 12 step programs, I didn’t want anything to do with it. Like I knew what happened in those rooms. I knew people stop drinking, and, and getting stoned in those rooms. And I didn’t want that I wanted nothing to do with that. As a matter of fact, I was like, keep all that in those rooms. And I’m not going to walk in there. And so that was my only option. So for me, I got a hold of, of a guy who just told me story. And I was just amazed at his story, because it sounded a lot like my story, right? And then he started telling me about what happened in his story, which sounded a lot like what happened to me, like, Hey, I don’t want to hurt anybody anymore. So I figured that, you know, maybe I would just take myself out of the equation so that my family would be better off. And then Then he told me another part, which kind of blew my mind, it was the part that I didn’t really believe in too much. It was a part of, you know, him not having a drink for the past five years. And I was like, that’s, you know, that’s impossible. Didn’t really force it down my throat. He didn’t really tell me this is how it has to be, you know, I approached him and I was like, you know, you’re cool guy. How’d you get so cool. And he’s just like, how I’m not really that cool. This is how I did it. And he was he was a fun guy to he didn’t when I approached him. He wasn’t just like, oh, you’re sick. This is sad. He’s like, look at this sick bastard right here. Look at this guy, you know, like us is a
He had a smile on his face. He hugged me, and you know, I wanted it. That’s really what happened is I got exposed to this in a very good light. And, you know, he worked me through a 12 step program quickly. It wasn’t like, Hey, take all the time that you need to do this. It was Let’s go now because I don’t know if you’re going to survive like the next couple days. And that’s what it was. It was like you’re drowning. You need this. You know, your arm is lobbed off, you need to have a tourniquet and you needed applied like an hour ago. But the next best time to do it is right now. So let’s do it. You know that that’s what happened. He ripped me through the steps like it says, in a particular piece of literature of anonymous program that we want to talk about. It says we launched into a course of vigorous action, you know, and that’s exactly what we did. No, it wasn’t like he did take your time. It was like, dude, now go make it happen.
Yeah, that’s one of my biggest gripes against. And I mean, you know, everybody’s story is different. Everybody’s journey is different. But like, I’ve heard people picking up year medallions being like, yeah, I took my time. And that’s, that’s what worked for me. And I mean, I can’t say to whether or not something works or doesn’t work. But I mean, if you’re sick, should you take your time and getting better? Or, you know, the whole diseases centered around you want instant gratification? What is the downside to getting the instant gratification the way that it was originally intended to be? And then you help other people. And then the altruism is part of what keeps you sober, longer, longer down the road, not this well. You know, you’re, you’re sick, and you need things immediately. So to stop you from getting your instant gratification, we’re going to make this as long and painful as possible. Yeah. And, and I mean, I see the merit of like, you’re not going to get this immediately. You have to want it, you have to earn it, but at the same time, like, Okay, what if you die before? before that happens? It’s just Well, he didn’t want it bad enough. And I, I don’t really subscribe to the kind of cop out that has been going around for a while of, well, if someone dies or someone relapses, it’s not your fault. They weren’t willing. And, okay, there’s an ounce of truth to that. But at the same time, like, if your responsibility is to help somebody else, how is that just not part of part of the deal? Like it just, it doesn’t really make sense to me how, how we’ve kind of twisted it into that, and nowhere is that really talked about in 12 step literature. I mean, they say if he disappears, like, don’t go hunting him down, like find someone who’s willing. But but that idea you? Oh, yeah, it took me a year to do my fourth step. And that’s what I needed. Now. That’s Bs, man, you didn’t need that. You just felt like chilling and doing absolutely nothing. Because anybody who’s been sober can tell you like, you can do it in an afternoon. And like, done forever, like, you keep going on. And I mean, it’s like an ever evolving piece of work and stuff. But like, it’s, it’s an afternoon, it’s it’s not a several month program. It’s an afternoon, like, worst case. A weekend. Yeah, like, if you’re, if you’re extreme, but like, it’s a couple hours. That’s, that’s what it is.
Yeah. And, you know, like, for, from my personal experience, to again, like totally blessed, not just for the sponsor, I had, it took me through the program, but also some of the men that he introduced me to, like, they, you know, they laid it down for me, they said, like, you know, the reason we’re taking you to the steps is not to help you men, so that you can help other people and through helping other people you will have helped yourself, that’s how it was laid out for me is like, we’re ripping you through the steps, you know, basically, like putting a rifle in your hand and sending you out to the front lines, because, like, that’s what’s going to keep you alive. You know, it’s not going to be sitting back here in the rear, like, this is where you know this where people die. So you want to get up front and helping people. And that’s man, that’s what we did. I mean, I can remember being in a, you know, being a being 30 years old man, and living in a house with eight other guys that were on the same path as me. And I’m college educated, I’m honorably discharged from the United States military. And here I am, like, in a house with a bunch of dudes riding a bike. And it’s just like, if that’s not humility, like I don’t know. I don’t know what really is. But that was humility for me. But I was also extremely grateful. You know, so you said, kind of come full circle, you said, was it difficult for you? I don’t think it was difficult because I knew that if it didn’t work, like I was going to go with Plan B and plan be was like the checkout, right? So I really did, you know, go 110% with it. I screwed up a gazillion times. I did, you know, a men’s wrong. I, you know, did. I did a bunch of things wrong, man. But once I found out that they were wrong, my sponsor told me that they were wrong, or my sober support network told me they were wrong, I fix them. You know, and I think I conduct myself the same way. You know, in business, too, is like, I, you know, I would rather have like imperfect action or in the military, we call the violent action, just just do it, just get out there and do it and f up and then we’ll fix it. But you know, better to do that than to sit on the sidelines and just constantly map something out, and then just never do it, which I feel like, you know, there are a lot of people, you know, in our, like, age group, even like in their 30s or younger to that, just do that, man, they just sit there and they’re just, they’re just watch, don’t do shit. You know? And yeah.
Or they’ll spin their wheels, just going in circles something to the effect of, Oh, well, I got 70 new followers on Instagram, like, I’m really building my business. And it’s like, no, you’re not How much money did you make? Like that’s, that’s the, you know, okay. There’s something to be said for, for having people following you and liking your page. And that’s okay. Part of part of the plan. But, you know, no one’s no one’s really no one’s buying groceries with likes. Yeah, no one. That’s not actual currency. That’s, that’s a representation and our reward for spinning your wheels playing on Facebook. But end of the day, if they’re not turning into paying clients, you don’t have a business, you’re just playing on Facebook and getting likes on a page that you call the business. Like, that’s, that’s what a lot of people do. And it’s crazy to me, I was he didn’t become a client. He wasn’t in any position to, to really move forward. But and I forget who the person was. But he basically was like, Oh, yeah, this influencer followed me on LinkedIn. And I was like, okay, so like, are you working out a deal with him or something? He’s like, no, but now he’s going to see my posts. And I was like, I don’t do business with people just because I see their posts. And like, what, that doesn’t mean anything. Someone followed you on LinkedIn. That’s, that’s all that that means. Like, you know, if you reached out to him, and you messaged him, and he messaged you back and you guys sat down, got coffee, like that would be moving the needle, but he was under the impression that, well, this guy follows me on LinkedIn. Therefore, my business is really taking off now. And that’s the delusion A lot of people have. Yeah, so what would you say is a better barometer of actual success in a business, just the action,
I think you can gauge success of a business by going to your client base, right, and seeing how many people that you’ve helped, you know, kind of like, you can gauge the success of a human beings life by looking at how many people that they’ve loved on and assisted. That’s how I gauge it, you know, go to your customer service aspect of your company and pull out, you know, all the hate mail and bullshit and everything, come through it and see how heavy the flow is. If it’s super heavy, and you’re not doing anything about it, then your business sucks. And it’s not going to be around for long. But that’s an area of my company that tend to live in, you know, it’s like, you know, feedback, feedback, feedback, like, we don’t have 100%, retention rate, surprise, anyone that’s listening to this, you know, we’ve lost clients, we’ve identified people that we thought would be a good fit for our service, but it turned out that they weren’t a good fit for the service. You know, and we’re learning the business has been in an operation for like, six or seven months, I think. And like, two of those months was just me solo, which I don’t even know if you want to count those months, but we can because I spent a lot of time awake and and you know, and working. But I think you know, what, what gauges a business, if you want a good business, a sustainable business is like, Hey, man, like, How good is your your product to your clients? Like, are you just shoveling bullshit, you know? Or are you doing the real deal? I mean, like, likes, who cares about likes? That’s never done anything for me, you know?
Yeah, I think it’s just kind of the culture that were brought up. And people, people believe that it actually means something. And then so many people believe it that when they hear it, other people saying, and it’s like, yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s, and I’m sure like, I’ll get an email from someone being like, you don’t know anything. I’ve got 10 Million Likes, and I made a billion dollars last year. I hate your podcast, love Bill Gates. So, so I mean, I’m, I know that you know, your world, in the lead gen marketing space, it’s saturated with people that are mediocre at best. So what separates you, especially on the clients, when you knock it out of the park, and like you said, it’s impossible to have 100% retention, but when you knock it out of the park, what’s separating you from the 10 million other people claiming to do what you do?
I think it’s just, I think it’s, I think it’s our, I don’t think it is I know it, I know, it’s a process, I know, it’s the customer service aspect of it I and I know it’s the front end to is it’s the fact that, you know, we’re not, we’re not a company that’s going to ever have thousands of people that we’re working with, or more of, let’s stay a boutique level, let’s, you know, hand hold and give a ton of value to our clients in exchange for, you know, some, some valuable feedback and to grow the product. I mean, you know, guys that know me know that, you know, I’m not the type of person that’s going to walk around with a Rolex in a Ferrari, right? Like, that doesn’t mean as much to me as having meaningful conversations, you know, with people turning my my, quote, unquote, clients into friends, like, that’s the stuff that fills me up. That’s the stuff that I like, you know, I don’t get a good feeling when I can’t get a client results. You know, I hate it. Because it’s not their fault. I look at it as my fault, like, What didn’t I do, and sometimes it might have been just like, hey, the sales training that I have for my guys was off, and we identified someone as a potential candidate for our program, who was not a potential candidate. But that’s not their fault. It’s my fault. And if I can continue, and I can teach my staff to continue to take accountability for themselves in their actions and their decisions, you know, I think we got something good. But if I can’t, you know, then, you know, I don’t have a company, I just have like an unchained dog just running around the yard, like, just going insane. So, you know,
I think that’s what separates me is just like, our company culture, you know, how we look at our clients. And then you know, the processes that we have to ensure that they’re successful. I love that you touched on the accountability aspect, because there’s so many times where companies when they fail to perform which it can happen, I mean, that’s part of any operation that has human beings and human beings are susceptible to error, be it intentional, unintentional, best intentions, bad intentions, whatever the case is, but taking that ownership, as the top level as the top of the company, to say, you know, each if I’m doing everything in my power, if my employees are acting a certain way, if my clients are getting a certain type of result that I’m not trying to get for them, like that all rises and falls on your shoulders as the owner. And yeah, you know, I wasn’t there that day, and this person did this. And they should have known that they shouldn’t do that. And as as tough of a pill as it is to swallow. Like, it all rises and falls on the leader of the company. It’s not the employees, it’s not the customers. There’s bits and pieces here and there. But I mean, if people are responding a certain way, and that’s not the way that you want them to respond, it’s most likely somewhere in the past, they have behaved that way. And it was either not addressed. So it’s a passive aggressive build up, more it was addressed, not followed up on. And I mean, I’m far from perfect in this area, just like as I’m saying, and I’m just thinking like, okay, yeah, my staff like, he yelled at, like three people yesterday for some stupid stuff that happened. And it’s like, yeah, Andrew, and whose fault was that? But it’s, it’s true, though.
It’s ours, man. It’s the it’s the ugly side of, of, I guess being an entrepreneur and business owners like, you know, just extreme accountability, you know, that they have.
You were saying you’re listening to Jocko Extreme Ownership while you’re in the gym. And how’s that hitting you?
I thank God every day, like I talked about my mom a lot. Like I’m gonna go ahead. And if you haven’t figured out like big family, I’ll talk with my dad. My dad was hard ass. This guy was getting hard ass man. And I would I very much did not enjoy his presence for a long time and life until I became an adult. And I remember him, you know, dropping me off just being like, Hey, man, like, you know, good luck in school luck in college, like now, you know, I’m still your father. But now we can be friends. Because like, I gave you everything. You know, I gave you everything I could, it’s up to you to take the rest of the way now, man, you’re You’re a grown ass man.
But he you know, so hard ass man. And like, he definitely 100% like drove home in our brains. Like, you know, like, take ownership. I take ownership for sure. You know, it’s not anybody else’s fault. But yourself. You know, like, like pony up for it. You know, and growing up in this little town and in New Jersey, you know, I, a lot of the guys that I grew up alongside of me, like, that wasn’t their households men, but for for me, it was just like, I grew up tough. It was tough. You know, it was you know, take ownership for it. You know, like manual labor did a lot of manual labor. It was the options were manual, or, or read your math book, you know, I did a post on that, like, probably like six months ago, I just thought that shit was normal. And I was telling somebody about it. They’re like, that’s not normal. I was like, I’m gonna make a post about it and kind of like relay, you know, the, my dad into it and the type of person that I am. And and people are like, wow, it’s amazing, man, you know, but he would say it all the time. He’s like, Listen, I’m going to leave you one day, and you’ll either be the best ditch digger in New Jersey or be the best mathematician is like, but you’ll never go hungry. And I hate that shit. And I hated it. But like, getting into even the military and like seeing, you know, like that other people were were saw to a degree, you know, and I was just sitting there like, man, all these dudes can yell at us. Like, they can’t like slap across the face or hit us with a bell or, you know, crack me across the face. Like, this is awesome. This is gonna be so much easier than
what a vacation
is gonna be easy. doing push ups and running anyway, like, that’s, that’s normal day and like, you know, and the yelling is nor that’s how we communicate at the dinner table. Like, wait, like, you know, I can’t get anything thrown at me or slapped. And you know, I don’t anybody on this on listening to this. Don’t ever feel bad for me. I deserve every slap across the face that I got, you know?
Definitely a button pusher for sure. Like, don’t do that. I’m like, Well, I’m gonna do that. I’m going to f1 do that. Excuse me.
yeah, that was a tangent. I’m sorry. I went Oh, no,
no, it’s all good. Are there any other audio books that have had an influence on you like, Extreme Ownership?
Yeah, so I messed it up between. So I used to have a commute. But now, you know, one of the great things about working for our company is that you know, we have remote location so you can work like I said, see a lot of my travel stuff. I like to work in different countries like to go all over the world and Islam, every new laptop is fired up and me and my entire staff can conduct business, behalf of our clients, but you know, Tim Ferriss four hour workweek was just an absolute Game Changer to me. The only other book that probably changed my life as much as that’s the blue one that you and I both know about.
You Michael Gerber.
Good friend of mine, Tim. Staci, if anybody knows him, he’s also a business owner, he recommended a book called The E myth revisited. Sir. And I it’s so grateful that I read that before I started this endeavor because it really like changed my mindset from like, a worker being mindset which my business would have failed that that was what it was to, like an entrepreneur is like, Hey, man, like you have to get outside of your business and look at it as a whole. And like, realize that you’re gonna have different divisions of the business, you know, marketing, sales, film and account management, billing human resources, and like your job, you know, going to at one point, you’ll be in those divisions, you’ll be the only one. But it’s important for you to develop the standard operating procedures and then put bodies into those standard operating procedures, make them like a living standard operating procedure, so that your company can can grow otherwise, you’re going to stay for growth. And, you know, I talked to a lot of entrepreneurs today and try to get them to read that book. And I know people hate to read nowadays, but I mean, like,
God, that saved me so much headache, because if I was still doing everything by myself right now, I would be losing my mind. Yeah, there’s, it’s crazy. Like the
mature your recommendations are literally like on my, I have on on my site. There’s the URL, it’s Lucy’s coaching. com slash RX r ACS. And it’s got basically like a laundry list of audio books and recommendations and things like that. Tim Ferriss four hour workweek, I would probably point like, the book I recommend the most. And Michael Gerber’s e myth revisited, as also that in the same sentence, what to do, I recommend the four hour workweek, and E myth revisited, and for different reasons. And just, you know, for people that that aren’t familiar, basically four hour workweek, it’s the idea of, if you’re very productive you can do it’s not just oh, well, I worked for four hours, and then chill the rest of the day, but you find where you’re productive. And then you put energy into that, and delegate the rest of the Bs, which goes hand in hand with the myth of have systems in place for other people to do the BS on your plate, so that you can do the things that are important to growing your business. I know for myself, and like, that’s one of the biggest things that I touched on, when I’m working with one on one with like business coaching with clients is getting drilled into their brain that you are a business owner, you are not the guy who fixes computers, you’re not the guy who builds websites, you are a business owner, and your product is that stuff that you used to do, and you used to trade all of your time so that you could get money. But now you’re in the business of trading money for other people’s time, and making sure that you have enough money to sustain other people to be holding on to their paychecks, as well as keeping your clients happy. And you’re no longer playing the game of how do I make more money work more hours. That’s, that’s the mindset we’ve been brought up and you’re supposed to get a good job. And you know, you work Work hard, you can work overtime and get time and a half, but you’re capped at the number of hours in a day. But when you play the role of a business, this owner and you can multiply, okay, I have one salesman and my net revenue is like $500 per week off of one salesman? How do I make more money? If I hire 10, more salesman, and I have all the processes and everything in place? That’s a good way to 10 X, your revenue, but you still have to be able to scale? And how do you scale? You have processes in place? How do you have processes in place, do your job and write down what you do, and then give it to somebody that doesn’t know how to do your job and have them follow along? That’s been one of the best ways that I’ve done training is just, here’s a piece of paper of what I think is a good enough description like an 8020. Like, here’s 80% of you know, I don’t have like details like line by line by line by line by line of every single nuance. But the idea of here is the big picture, follow this. And if they can follow it, for the most part, gets rid of it gets rid of the issues of why didn’t you reply to this email? Oh, I didn’t know I was supposed to supposed to reply to the email. Well, we have in place when there’s an upset customer that emails, here’s how you handle it. accountability, like all these things, and it’s kind of obvious when you hear people talking about it. And I know for myself, I I knew that idea. But I was kind of in the mindset of this isn’t actually a real business. It’s just me fixing computers in my halfway house. So so so it was, it was a different mindset. And that’s that’s all I knew. So when you started dawn patrol, were you just like, I’m a business owner right off the bat? Or was it was kind of a learning experience to be like, I’m doing all the work. Now how do I let go some of this responsibility and let other people handle some of it.
So I, again, man, I
everything that I’ve, I’ve done like how I know I’m doing the right thing in life is by how, how much I have to wrestle with the idea of doing it. Now. That doesn’t mean like, Hey, you know, everything in my life I know is right, because it’s easy, because it’s definitely not easy, but it’s like wrestling with the idea of like going down a certain route. Like if I have to wrestle with something a lot, like wrestle with, like, you know, like, Hey, is it good for me to go here? Should I be living here? Should I be living with her whatever the case is, like, if it’s if it’s a wrestle, I know, it’s not good. And if it’s, you know, if it’s fluid, but I’m like, hey, there’s a lot of work in front of me, like I go for it. And that’s kind of like what it was like, with my business mentors and relationships that I had as well. So funny story, the guy that
the guy that I got into marketing with initially, you know, was like, was like a,
about a decade sober. Right, like I, I submitted a form online to be part of a community of, of marketers and and business owners. And the last question on the forum, said, I would have the opportunity to pay to get into this group was What’s the hardest thing that you’ve ever done in your life. And I put, getting sober, was tough, right? It’s the hardest thing I ever had to do. And I immediately got a phone call. And the guy called me and say, Hey, I just want to know, like this, this guy know, he’s been sober for a decade, and I was I was totally sold. At that point, I was like, take, I was like, I need to get in this group, I need to be in it. It’s a Visa card, let me know when you’re ready. Like, let’s let’s run this. And then just like meeting him, and like meeting other people that, you know, we’re 10 steps ahead of me. And we’re willing to give back so long as like, I was willing to do the work. And then also, you know, as this like, group of guys together, like turn around and provide value and like, get my time back and be like, Hey, guys, like I’m split testing company, or I’m doing something with marketing, or I’m trying something with my operations centers. You should do it too. It wasn’t difficult for me because I was still at my previous company data lot. When I was reading the book by Michael Gerber. Right, the E myth revisited. So I’m reading this E myth revisited. I’m watching these guys actively carry it out, you know, and I’m talking to guys like in tech deals that are like, hey, in six months or less, I could totally be removed for a company and have a self sustaining. I’m like, What? How do you do that? You know, because Tim Ferriss book was the first one I read. So I was very interested in you know, automating companies. And, you know, we use a lot of virtual assistants, you know, in Central and South America, and in the Philippines, who are phenomenal. They’re phenomenal, guys, and we pay them well, overhead and really good wages, for where they’re at the world. It works for us, and it works for them. And, you know, it’s, it’s great, man, it wasn’t, it wasn’t difficult for me to remove myself, because from day one, that’s the goal. And it’s, it’s still the goal, man. It’s like, now that I’m the CEO of the company, I’m trying to figure out how I can become the CEO and what’s even entailed in the CEOs job, you know, and then I’m trying to figure out, like how to, you know, boost myself out of my company, because successful guys, it drives me nuts. They’re not just like, Hey, I’m the business owner, this, they’re like, I’m the business owner, 15, friggin businesses, I’m on the board of directors, I’m doing this, I’m doing that you’re just like, how are you able to accomplish that, like, when you know, I have one job, I’m a sales guy, I’m, you know, totally comp sales guy. And I’m, you know, I’m working 70 hours a week, because I’m just have this fire me where I got a sound. And they’re like, you need to find someone else to do it for you. Or you need to learned to teach guys to do it, or you need to learn, you know how to manage guys and build the business off of it. So for me, dude, it wasn’t difficult, because I knew that was the goal. From day one, it’s like I wouldn’t be able to accomplish what I wanted to accomplish without without help. So wasn’t tough for me.
I guess that’s so cool that your experience coming into it very different than a lot of people that you understood that you have to run a business and not just own a job. Like there’s, it’s funny, you know, that the dream job when you’re a kid, it’s like, oh, you should be a doctor or, or a lawyer. And I kind of think about it, it had like when you were saying like, Oh, these people had like four company or 13 companies, you said I was like I only have four. But, but like the idea of a doctor or a lawyer. I mean, you’re trading your time for money. And I mean, if you if you own a practice, and you have other people working with you and I work, one of my clients is a doctor, one of my business coaching clients. And when I introduced the idea of you should build it up and have people work for you train people think of what you’d be able to accomplish with this time and this time, and he was just like, but when I make less money, and then we sat down and did the math, and I was like, No, you make a lot more money, and you do less work if you run it the right way. And he was just like, but that doesn’t make sense. Like, if I am not the one doing all the work? How is it possible that I make more money, and I was like that is the secret to all business ever is like you can make more money, if you just put in the effort to make a good system, and make sure that they’re good enough metrics, you can make sure that your system is still working well, and that your people are still working well. I mean, you had touched on like, you travel all the time. Like I travel all the time. And when I see how much you travel, I think Man, I wish I could travel as much as like it.
I only show you all the glorious stuff, man, trust me, there’s a lot of like, in January, when we were I mean, we blew up almost our company levels 360%, in less than 30 days, it was it was excessive. And I’m in Bali, and I’m 13 hours ahead of us and most of our business is going to be you know, located in central or eastern time zones, right? And it was, you know, so I’m working from 6pm at night, till seven o’clock in the morning, I get off at seven, I go sir, I go eat breakfast, ride my scooter around a little bit until I’m just like, Yo, I need to go to sleep, sleep through the days. And then on the weekend, you know, we would travel places and do fun stuff. But you know, like, I was grinding in in Bali, I was grinding out big time, hiring people developing the SAP and again, like imperfect action. You know, we would make SAP we’d run the VA through it, they would jack stuff up. We did I know. It’s not your fault. It’s not your fault. It’s our fault. You did exactly what we told you to do. Now we know we need to tweak it. And we tweaked it and tweaked and tweaked it until you know we got it to a nice sustainable point. And we got the right people in it. We’re always looking for, you know, additional people. But But yeah, I mean, we got it to a nice sustainable amount. And it was it’s been, it’s been awesome, then I’ve been able to kind of step away more and more and more to like a higher level where like, you know, we’re not now we’re, you know, we’re heavy on marketing. You know, we didn’t do too much marketing initially. It’s funny, I tell everyone is like, yeah, you know, we’ve scaled up, you know, Facebook ad agency, to, you know, over six figures a month and we didn’t have to, you know, even spend two pennies on boosting an ad that I had to do it. And I was like, outbound dialers, you know, sales guys, that’s pretty much what we did sales guys, and then organically through Facebook. Like, wow, that’s, that’s crazy. But now we’re starting to like, get into that realizing like, yeah, maybe you know, we should do something besides just outbound harass people.
Yeah, well, there’s, there’s something to be said to for having more legs on the stool to keep it up. Because I know, just in my own experience, like with, with rush tech, like, we’ve reinvented ourselves probably five different times of just completely different marketing. And you know, what works one day, you can just wake up the next next day some algorithm changes, something is on the news, something can just shift overnight. And I hate seeing the businesses that are the say like, Oh, well, I don’t need to market my business, all we do is word of mouth. And that’s perfect. And, to an extent, like, that’s great that you’re getting that. But what happens when just say you don’t close the next round of leads, right? Your your referrals that came in, are you going to keep hitting up your existing clients, say, hey, I need more and more referrals. Because this is my only point of getting new customers. Sorry, we’re out well, so then you’re just out the end, you can’t get any more customers. And I mean, I’ve seen it happen countless times like one algorithm change and Facebook, and something that was converting at, excuse me something converting at like a dollar a lead jumps $250 a lead because now you can’t use this word anymore. Or this image now has text in it that violates this policy. Like it’s so fragile, that if your marketing is dependent on just one thing. And one of the things that I wanted to touch on. So I was reading through some of your posts and how you kind of you you walk the reader through it, I’m assuming you do email marketing with with this copy, I’m just going to assume that, but you do something along the lines of like I saved $1 on on water by not getting bottled water versus tap water. And now I’ve spent $30 on bathroom accessories. Because I tried to save $1 and ruined everything. That’s why you should hire somebody to do your marketing for you. I’m going to assume like the meta, like, that’s your marketing of your marketing is how you tell stories and like relate them.
Yeah, pretty much man. I like to I like to tell stories, and people will say like, Oh, is that a, you know, true story, some of the stuff and which is a fair question. And my response sometimes will be like, Dude, it’s true. You know that it is a story.
That’s true. You know, you got to peel it apart and figure it out. But that story was absolutely true. You know, I was there with a good friend of mine, Pat. And I think we really had a nice place and they call in Costa Rica they don’t call it tap water because they know they can’t say that shit. They’re call it house water. Do you want this this bottled water in the house water and then my house water’s fine. You know, so I have this house water at this fancy restaurant and I’m like, I can handle this ram spending all this money on water. You know, I’m spending all this money on food. But the one thing I can’t instead of spending $1 on water, I’m like, That’s ridiculous. There’s no I don’t drink bottled water at home, drink it out of cup, you know, like, We’re fine. And, and we went to this they call these roadside eateries they call them sodas, and coasters. So if you ever get a terminology soda, and by the column, while runs, I’m probably butchering How to say that, but it’s basically just like a roadside place, you get a meal, it’s cheap. And, you know, you’ll get some local fair there, it’s really good. My rule of thumb has always been this, that there’s a lot of people there a lot of locals end. A lot of non locals, like it’s probably safe. I that’s one of my big things. And then like make sure that the person is not collecting the cash, I mean, with food. And then, you know, just make sure a lot of these places they’ll, you know, they’ll cook it in front of you, you know, so this hit all of the things is it was going to be okay. So I you know, I got Coke, and I got a glass of water and I was extremely thirsty, pounded the water. Everything was fine. And then we got on a speedboat from haka in Costa Rica to St. Theresa. And like halfway through this speedboat like I hit my stomach and we were in the middle of the water. And I was like, Oh, and I was very uncomfortable, very uncomfortable. And so we hit the first app, which is Montezuma, and then we took a bus from Montezuma, Montezuma to St. Theresa in Costa Rica. And, man, I was tough. It was really bumpy road, it was not a good show for me or for my friend Patrick. And we had to go see doctors, which I found out I totally got shim Sham on that deal, because I brought this like bullshit looking prescription to the pharmacy. And these girls just laughed at me that like, yeah, like he could just came here and got this shit. Just tell us tell us, right? So it’s just like this dude in an office. I knew it was so shady. Because there was no one there. It was just me. He’s like, I want to take your blood. I’m like, dude, you’re not taking my blood. I’m like, you know what’s wrong with me? I’m like, give me the antibiotics. And he’s like, well, he put like a step is so my heart. I’m like, What are you doing pen? Like, I drank the water. I’m sick. I can’t stop shooting, I want to vomit all over the place. I’m like, just give me what you give people for travelers diarrhea. And if it doesn’t work, like I’ll come back. So he’s like, all right, fine. It’s $100 USD, though, to see me because I fight. Oh, so I got shamed out of 100 bucks, but and then I got the antibiotics. And then I was good to go. And the next one,
Hey, you know what, though, it’s like one of those things where someone may be like listening to this, and like, Oh, I love that story of like saving $1. And how all these things happened. Like, I want you to write my email copy for me. But people people really do connect that when you tell a story. And then you can related come back to what what the people like what your product is what your services like in in our companies, drip emails, they when people sign up, we send them emails, and it basically it’s like, kind of pulling, pulling back the curtain of like, behind the scenes of, hey, you’re here now in 2019. And this is what the company looks like. But if you were one of the brave souls that was trying this out five years ago, like this is what happened. Like, I was so afraid that people would find out that I was the only employee and when people would call and be like, Are you the only one that works here? I would just say no, we have like dedicated account managers. And that way you got like the best service possible. And they’re like, Oh, that’s a great idea. And but now, like we do have dedicated account managers as a result of back then I was just trying to like, put up this facade that I was bigger than I was and, and now it’s like, Hey, you know, people really liked that. And so we took that idea and ran with it. And now even though we’ve got this many people working with us, now you still get that one on one experience, just like the people used to have, but you also get it with all these extra resources. And all these new features and technologies changed over the last five years. So it looks nothing like it used to. But people people they like those stories, like I get responses from the emails. And I think it’s funny that they like reply to, to automatically send emails, and they’re like, Great story. I love this. I love your company. And like I just, it’s not too often that I’ll send an email to a do something that I know is automated. But what I’m starting to find in actually getting, like authors and I’ve got by the time this episode will get aired. I’ve got like a ton of authors with like big followings and stuff coming up on the show and like getting through to them. Sometimes it’s just like, I’ll sign up on their email list and then just reply, because like, someone had to write it, like, someone sometimes replies to the autoresponder and like, I’ve gotten in touch with people that way. And they’re like, Hey, man, like, sure, like I’ll, I’ll send them a message on on Facebook, send them a message on LinkedIn, and reply to a to an automatic email, like join their email list. And I’m getting in touch with influencers that are just like, way beyond who I thought I’d be able to get in touch with. And it’s like, you know, you just got to kind of think outside the box. And I think, though, coming back around, like the telling of the stories, because I always try to incorporate, like, Hey, your message is to achieve XY and Z. And you can achieve that through this platform. And that’s, that’s really one of the things that I’ve like, really discovered in the last, the last really like two months, like, right around, like when, when I had first reached out to you, which is about two months ago. And here we are, but like, right around that time, it was like, how, how could I reach people that just aren’t in my, like, direct network, or, you know, some people used to work for me and say, Hey, you got to get in touch with Bill like he’s doing big things, which is really cool, what you’re doing. And it’s crazy to see to like, you know, you’re just just threw this together, and now you’re crushing it. Like, when I was like six months, and I had nothing to show for it. I was probably just like, yeah, my page has like 30 likes.
I just knew I just knew I had to get a bunch of people around man, like when I started it. Like, I remember like the first couple months, man, I started the business like a Kickstarter man, I’m like, Hey, this is the concept you can get on the ground floor level, I have nothing to deliver you for like two months. And people are like, Yeah, all right, you did good work for us that the company you are at Are you stood there and like, kind of don’t tell anybody about it, you know, and it was great. And I used like every dime of that initial startup, to outfit troops and to attract guys, you know, to work not for but like with me, you know, and and like, it was great. It was great. like, dislike my this guy, my buddy Gary, you know, he’s like, the head of our account management department. I mean, the guys like I love him to death, you know, I love working with them. He doesn’t put his name behind bullshit he cares about you know, our clients, and my clients are his clients, they’re ours, you know, and Nate, you know, our, our sales director is just like, they’re just as that that won’t do halfway. And they’re just guys that go all in on anything that they do, whether they’re sweeping the floor, whether they’re trying to figure out a dynamic way of presenting our our clients with a better end product, you know, like, how do we make it easy, and we have these we have these huddle. Every morning, you know, and at the close of business every morning, each one of our divisions has a huddle, they fill out a form that form gets kicked up to all the other management so everyone knows exactly what’s going on in every other division. And then at the end, we have a leadership huddle, where we pull it all together know what’s something short term that we can do to increase the effectiveness of our product to our clients, and what’s something long term that we can do to increase the effectiveness of our product. And like that way, you know, we’re, we’re just trying to get a better man every single day, like, what can we do for a big win in the next seven days? Or can do for big win next three months? And what are we doing now, that’s awesome, that we don’t want to stop doing. You know, and as long as we keep doing the good things, and then keep on looking at the things we could be doing better, hiring better people going from Facebook, to YouTube, to Google and like trying out different, you know, social media, distribution networks, different, you know, search engines, you know, to drive traffic, you know, which one’s going to give the most qualified traffic to our end user. It’s, it tends to just keep getting better man, you know, we’re just, we’re focused on more on the mastering the process than we are unlike Hey, like, we made a bunch of money. You know, it’s good, when we look at the bank accounts, and we’re like, Alright, cool that we can hire more awesome people, you know, we can, we can buy this course that just came out for five grand that I think is going to be a game changer. Let’s buy it and give it to our account managers, you know, this retention for profit course, let’s give you know, this, this YouTube course, you know, to our fulfillment department. So it’s great. We’re not just like making the product better, but we are teaching, you know, the people that work with us more so that they can get up and walk out of our place and get a job someplace we’re making twice as much as they’re making with us. But our hope is, is that, you know, we have such a solid culture that they wouldn’t want to get up and go anyplace else. You know.
I love that perspective. I think it’s Richard Branson. He says your employees aren’t a liability, they’re an asset. And if you’ve got people that are doing the right thing, time and time again, you know, I’m, and maybe to my, to my own fault. But when I say like, Oh, you shouldn’t play favorites, like I look at that more as you should reward excellence and not treat everybody the same as everybody doesn’t perform the same. Like the guy who shows up 30 minutes early, does training, gets on the phone, helps other people and doesn’t ask for anything in return, stays late, will give up opportunities, because he knows that someone else could use a win. Like, I’m going to give that guy more opportunity than the guy who shows up, leaves early complains, gets upset, can’t control his temper, you know, and you’re playing favorites, like I am rewarding on merit. Like I try to take emotions, friendships, all these intangible business things out of the equation. But like if you come in and perform, and black and white metrics on numbers that matter. If you go above and beyond, I will reward you if if its attention leads something that you you need that out of what we normally do. I’m willing to do that for the people that are willing to put in not expecting anything else in return. Because I want that person to feel special. And if someone else sees the special treatment and gets upset by it, it’s not. It’s not just based on well, that guy’s my friend, it’s well that guy’s you know, the best salesman that yet he’s giving you opportunities, when it’s in his best interest to hold on to that lead and call it an hour later, after he gets off the phone with someone else. But you know, neither here nor there. It’s just I know, people said, well, you play favorites. And I’ve got black and white numbers and metrics of why I give attention and rewards to people who earn it not to people who I like people who earn it. And so bill in wrapping up, what what advice would you give to somebody who’s struggling with addiction, drinking, trying to get out of it? What would you say is like the best piece of advice that you would give to someone who’s interested in stopping using
was at a meeting, it was a meeting, I was watching a good friend of mine
be awarded a four year medallion. And at that meeting, there was a guy that that came up
that came up to the stage and was a warning, I guess another guy like a 10 year medallion or something. And he said, he said a lot of things. But one thing that stood out to me said that there’s nothing there’s nothing wrong. You can say to someone who’s ready to get sober. And there’s nothing right that you can say to someone who isn’t ready to get sober. So what I would say to someone who’s considering it is that when you’re ready, we’re here.
So good. And now same question, but geared towards someone who’s trying to make the jump into entrepreneurship. What would you say is the best piece of advice
follow your heart, man. That’s it. You know, I I
went back and forth if I should if I should leave my job or not like I was doing well at that a lot like I had for the first time like cracked into six figures. yearly salary. I don’t have a wife and a kid. I already had toys like a truck a Harley surfboards like a place on the beach. So like I was doing all right, monetarily, but I couldn’t pick like who I wanted to work with where I wanted to work when I wanted to work. And after reading Tim Ferriss book, like I was like, Man, that would be awesome. If I could do that, man, if I could do my job from Costa Rica, or from Bali, or from Thailand or the Dominican Republic, or Colombia, like that would be my dream. And no, like, but what I would say is is is you know, like, like talk to people and write a letter men like my my sponsor at the time, maybe write two letters, one to God, to ask for the willingness to make the leap. that’s truly what I wanted. And the second letter he made me write with my resignation letter to my job before I’d actually quit. And I taped it up near my computer and I looked at it every day until I realized that the pain of me not doing this would be greater than the pain of me doing it because worst case scenario if I would have failed, I would have just
been working at Rush
someplace else as a cell but I don’t know, man, you know, like I knew I had a salesman skill set and I knew I would always be in demand. And my dad’s like, honestly, like, Dude, what do you got to lose? Like, he’s scared the shit. I mean, you can always come back home
and live and I was like, oh,
anything like that?
It’s like I’m never gonna
Yeah, well, I mean, if if the tables for whatever reason something happens you vote you’ve always got a job. Welcome at Rush. And Bill. It was it was great having you on the show, man. I had a lot of fun. And thanks, everyone for listening, self made and sober. If you enjoyed the episode, please like share, subscribe, all those things that aren’t going to put money in my pocket. But I do appreciate the the thumbs up and you know, hopefully we can we can have a big impact and be able to reach people that maybe can’t hear this message, but really need it. So thanks again. Bill is great talking to you.
Thanks for having me on the show. Andrew, appreciate it.
Thank you so much for listening to sell made and sober. Be sure to join our Facebook [email protected] slash groups slash SMC mastermind like self made coaching mastermind. I hope you enjoyed this show.
There’s nothing wrong you can say to someone who’s ready to get sober, and there’s nothing right that you can say to someone who isn’t ready to get sober.